How Trump and Harris debated Ukraine

I fact-checked Trump and Harris on Ukraine. Here are my takeaways

Unsurprisingly, last night's presidential debate (or this morning’s, if you are in Kyiv) was full of lies, dodged questions, and theatrical accusations.

I tuned in to see what former President Donald Trump and VP Kamala Harris would say about my country, Ukraine, and their plans to deal with Russia’s war. Trump’s shallow promises to end the war fast were predictable — he repeated the same years-old lines over and over. Harris, on the other hand, pushed hard against Trump’s ties to dictators and Putin himself.

Here’s how Trump and Harris debated Ukraine and Russia at their first presidential debate and whether any of it was truthful or useful.

The first mention of Ukraine came up after the moderators asked Trump about his plans to end the war in Gaza. Trump responded:

“If I were president (Russia’s war) would have never started. If I were president Russia would have never, ever — I know Putin very well. He would have never — and there was no threat of it either, by the way, for four years — have gone into Ukraine and killed millions of people when you add it up. Far worse than people understand what's going on over there.”

Let’s fact-check this. First, Russia’s war started in 2014, not in 2022, when Moscow first invaded Ukraine and occupied 7% of its territory in Crimea and Donbas. In those Trump’s four years, Russia was already killing and torturing Ukrainians. Regardless of whether one addresses the full-scale invasion specifically or Russia’s aggression against Ukraine overall, it’s false to say that “there was no threat of it,” whatever it is. Russia has ALWAYS posed a threat to Ukraine, period. It is a fact rooted in centuries of history and modern precedent.

After discussing Israel, Trump also added:

“I'll get the war with Ukraine and Russia ended. If I'm President-Elect, I'll get it done before even becoming president.”

This is Trump’s popular talking point — ending the war “in 24 hours” or “before inauguration day” or some other impossible timeframe. It’s impossible, for one, because Ukraine and Russia have already tried negotiating several times and got nowhere (the Istanbul talks would have amounted to Ukraine’s capitulation; just read the deal). And it’s impossible for a bunch of other reasons, most importantly: 1) Russia shows no genuine willingness to negotiate, and 2) the Ukrainian government is unlikely to sign an unfavorable deal because it would be risking major societal upheaval (most Ukrainians reject giving up territory for the sake of ending the war).

Harris came back attacking Trump’s love for dictators and Putin.

"It is well known that he admires dictators, wants to be a dictator on day one according to himself. It is well known that he said of Putin that he can do whatever the hell he wants and go into Ukraine. It is well known when that he said when Russia went into Ukraine it was brilliant. It is well known he exchanged love letters with Kim Jong Un. And it is absolutely well known that these dictators and autocrats are rooting for you to be president again because they're so clear, they can manipulate you with flattery and favors,” Harris said.

This is mostly true, though with some caveats.

Trump said he wanted to be a dictator only on his first day in office so he could deal with the border and expand fracking. “We’re closing the border and we’re drilling, drilling, drilling. After that, I’m not a dictator,” he said.

Trump also criticized NATO members for not meeting the 2% defense spending benchmark — just six states met it in 2021, and 23 (!) do now — and said that he wouldn’t protect the countries lagging behind. “In fact, I would encourage them (Russia?) to do whatever the hell they want. You got to pay your bills,” Trump said. He didn’t say Putin can go into Ukraine, though.

He also said that Russia’s tactic of legally recognizing the independence of its sham proxy formations on occupied territories of Donbas to justify its invasion by claiming to help keep the peace there was “genius” and “pretty savvy”.

The dozens of letters with North Korea’s dictator — “beautiful” letters, as Trump said — are also true.

Whether all autocrats are rooting for Trump is slightly less obvious in this election; Putin, for example, openly endorsed Harris, even though his state propaganda is still praising Trump. But the precedent of Trump’s cozy relationship with the dictators is well-documented. Equally obvious is just how much the autocrats will benefit from Trump wreaking havoc on the world order and abandoning NATO and other alliances.

The next exchange was telling, and I want to thank the moderators for asking Trump a direct question:

“Do you want Ukraine to win this war?” the moderator asked.

“I want the war to stop,” Trump said.

After he criticized Europe for not spending enough money on helping Ukraine, moderators asked him again whether Ukraine's victory was in the U.S. best interests.

“I think it's in the U.S. best interest to get this war finished and just get it done” Trump said.

This is crucial because it makes it clear that Trump doesn’t care about Ukraine and what happens to it one way or the other. He isn’t interested in helping Ukraine defeat Russia and liberate all its territory. He just wants the problem gone.

When Harris was asked how she would approach Ukraine and Putin, she first attacked Trump for potentially abandoning Ukraine and then jumped to listing the Biden administration’s efforts to help the country, as well as her role in it.

I’ll shorten her response for clarity.

"I actually met with Zelenskyy a few days before Russia invaded…I shared with him American intelligence about how he could defend himself. Days later I went to NATO's eastern flank, to Poland and Romania. And through the work that I and others did we brought 50 countries together to support Ukraine in its righteous defense. And because of our support… Ukraine stands as an independent and free country,” Harris said.

Harris also, correctly, explained that Putin’s imperial ambitions stretch well beyond Ukraine. She sounded excellent, but I’ll shorten the part again.

“Putin's agenda is not just about Ukraine. Understand why the European allies and our NATO allies are so thankful that you (Trump) are no longer president and that we understand the importance of the greatest military alliance the world has ever known, which is NATO. And what we have done to preserve the ability of Zelenskyy and the Ukrainians to fight for their Independence.

Otherwise, Putin would be sitting in Kyiv with his eyes on the rest of Europe. Starting with Poland. And why don't you tell the 800,000 Polish Americans right here in Pennsylvania how quickly you would give up for the sake of favor and what you think is a friendship with what is known to be a dictator who would eat you for lunch.

Trump pushed back, of course, saying that Trump would be happily sitting in Moscow because he “wouldn’t have lost 300,000 men and women”. It is abundantly clear by now that Putin does not care about sending his people to die in his wars. If Putin was worried about losing 300,000 citizens, he wouldn’t have started the war.

Trump also said that Putin has nuclear weapons — “a thing that other people don’t have” (except that the U.S. does), and a thing that “nobody ever thinks about” (except that every American official does, perhaps too much so, if you ask a Ukrainian).

Then Trump lied by accusing Harris of failing to prevent the war because she was the “emissary” sent in to negotiate with Zelensky and Putin. She wasn’t. She never actually met Putin or spoke with him.

My key takeaway: Harris is clearly much more interested in helping Ukraine, although it’s important to highlight that she also didn’t directly say she wants Ukraine to win and Russia to lose. While speaking at length about supporting Ukraine, she actually dodged that particular question.

It matters because many Ukrainians have grown resentful towards the U.S. for being overly cautious in their approach to Russia, so much so that many believe Washington was never interested in Russian defeat. This is irreconcilable with the mainstream Ukrainian view that Russia must lose militarily for Ukraine’s long-term safety.

In other words: just helping Ukraine survive while Russia is slowly taking more and more territory — which is what’s happening now — or pushing Ukraine towards some deal is not the solution Ukrainians want. Ukrainians want to defeat Russia to be safe in the future. I’m afraid neither candidate is giving us that.